DIY Network

Hello all. I'm new here. I did quick search on this subject but didn't come up with anything. I'd really appreciate any input you all can offer, because I've never undertaken a project like this before. Most i've done was hang some shelves.

Here's a front and back view of the fence at the side of my house:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gibbous/sets/72157607400978089/detail/

I have a small trailer I'd like to store back there. It is 67" wide.

The length of the fence from post to post is 6'10". The larger section post to
post is 4'5", and the smaller section is 2'1.5". The end posts and middle post are set in the ground with cement.

I thought about just installing hinges and making it a gate. The main problem is the slope. Both sides of the ground underneath the fence are sloped, and the fence portions
would strike the ground before opening up enough to fit the trailer in.

So here's my idea, I need help refining it: I'd like to make the fence removable in two
pieces. So I guess my question is: would this be feasible and still structurally sound? And
the second part to that is: how do I do it?

Did some googling and found this product:

http://www.thesuperpost.com/buy.asp

This uses a sleeve to surround the post. You would set the sleeve in concrete in the ground, and slip the fence post right in.

Here's what I've managed to come with as far as implementation:

1. Remove and reinforce both fence lengths. I would fasten four pieces of lumber in an "X"
pattern on the larger fence portion. And maybe one or two pieces of lumber diagonally on
the smaller one. I would leave the middle post attached to the smaller portion. I would
cut the middle post as close to flush with the ground as I could.

2. Affix 4"x4" posts to the fence, to extend some length into the ground using the "Super
Post" product.

Questions:

- The fence at it's highest point is 5'3" Should I go 18", 24", or 36" into the ground?
- Is there a better way to do this?
- This seems easier than i thought, but since I've never set a fence post before, is there
anything I should know?

Thanks!
- Edgar

Hi gibbous,

I've examined the pictures but from both views it is difficult to tell exactly how they align. It appears that the part of the fence closest to the house is lower than that along your property. It also appears as those you built a section from the fence slong the property line to that against the house which angles down to the height of the fence closest to the house. It also appears as though this shorter angled section has a post between it and that part attached to the house.

It seems as though the post that is the problem is the one I mentioned above between the two sections of fence at the front.

It appears as though the section closest to the house is a good size. I'd consider attaching a post to the house and adding hinges and making this part a gate that may swing. You may wish to check a farming supply store for screw in lags with an eye which accepts a 3" long 1/2" to 5/8 diameter pin which can be screwed to the back of the fence with 6 or 8 screws and allows the whole fence section to be lifted off entirely as well as act as a gate and swing. (Remember how semi-trailers had sides that were lifted off and had pins that slid into eyes in the adjacent side units. It's a similar type of mechanism that I'm referring too.) This though would take 2 men to lift as that section is likely heavy. It would also require cross bracing to strength it and prevent it from shifting and settling. I'd consider using stainless screws or ceramic coated ones to prevent rusting. As to the other post in the middle, I'd cut it off at ground level. I'd also make the shorter fence a gate and likely hinge it similarly to the gate I just mentioned though conventional heavy duty hinges 3 or 4 attached to the post that supports the fence along your property would also work. Being smaller it will need cross bracing but will weigh less than the other gate. As to the post being cut off leave it attached to the short section of fence but develop a locking mechanism which secures the 2 sections together.

Now lets lock the post back in place on top of where it was cut off. On the cut fence post attach a metal locking rod on both sides of the post which can slide up and down in a channel you attached to both sides of the post. This locking rod can be 1/2 diameter steel in an L shape about 12 to 14" long. Dig along side of the post in the ground on both sides and attach a metal channel which you screw on both side of the post like you did to the other section of the post. When the post is in place slide the L bar down the channel locking it place on both side of the post in the ground. This is much like a locking mechanism on a double front door where one opens constantly and the other only when needed by pulling free the upper and lower locking pins both doors may be opened. This seems like less work and cost than what you have considered doing. You may find this L pin and channel likely in a farming supply store as well.

As far as the ground problem, consider shortening your fence at the ground to give you the clearance you need. It's the easiest solution and should allow the gates to swing.

Some thoughts to consider.

Good Luck.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Simply Me,

Thanks Simply Me,

I think you've got the fence about right. The middle post is the issue, but the sloped ground is a problem, as well. I don't want to change the look of the fence at all from the front if I can avoid it. I live in a planned community so I have to observe the CC&Rs. Shortening the fence is probably not an option.

Here's the direct links to the large sizes of the fence pictures:
rear:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gibbous/2874162384/sizes/l/

front:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gibbous/2874162482/sizes/l/

A couple of detail questions about your suggestions, which do seem a lot simpler and easier than what I was thinking:

How would I go about attaching the post next to the house to the house? Do I drill into a stud the same as hanging a picture? What kind of screws should I use? If I put something thin but stiff over the stucco, like a piece of card board, would a stud finder still be able to find a stud?

I'm having trouble picturing this "screw-in lag with an eye" you're talking about. Are there any pictures you can link me to? I like the idea of a solution that would allow the gate to swing and be removed. If this solution would allow the fence to lift a bit without coming completely off the hinges, it may even allow me to clear the uneven ground below while swinging the gate doors open, simply by lifting the gate as I swing it, thereby eliminating the need to even remove the gate pieces altogether!

Thank you very much for you help, it is greatly appreciated.

UPDATE: found some hardware that I think matches what you were describing, Simply.

http://www.hooverfence.com/woodfence/shehinge.htm

And some other hardware, that seems like it would also do the trick:

http://www.hardwaresource.com/Store_ViewProducts.asp?Cat=1354

Seems like they would work. Now I'm excited.

Hi gibbous,

I like both that you found. On the first link I'd choose the 5/8" thick ones. On the second link which I like better, I'd also buy the 5/8" hinges but also the ones that are either 10 or 12" long. Of the 2 links I like the second link better because it allows the hinges to be lagged or bolted to a solid framing member. Using the ones in the first link, both screw in to their members for support and under stress they may split the post leaving you with the need to replace those framing members. Whichever you choose I'd try to add 3 or 4 hinges because this will relieve the load on the others and have less chance of sagging so long as the gate is beefed up adequately to support the load. The way the fence is made will require that you reconsider dismantling it and remake it as a gate with sufficient support to hang off the hinges and not sag over time. You may find that you may use both style hinges and make one section a lift out panel and the smaller hinges may work perfectly for this purpose. Doing this would allow you to use fewer hinges on the house side if the fence bottom rests on the ground.

As to anchoring a post to your home, you do need to mount to a stud but it may be necessary to open the wall inside your home and backup the stud on either side with a 4' 2x4 on each side of it or put in a 4' or as long as needed 4x4 post with 2x4" attached top and bottom and nail it to the studs on either side and the bottom plate. This is the nuisance factor in the fence but it will ensure that the fence post is adequately anchored to your home. I'd also caulk the back side of the fence post to seal out water and lag it to the house drilling pilot holes first through the post and into the supporting timber inside the home. using a washer on each lag bolt for added support. On mounting the post to the house, examine the grain of the post and mount it so the grain is parallel to the wall of the house not perpendicular so there is less chance of the post splitting under stress and load from the hinges.

If you have a TSC store in your area check out their hinges or ask one of the clerks. If you print off the diagram of the first link that you posted and show it to them it may help you find what you need.

Good Luck!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Simply Me,

I think I've decided to "hybrid" the two ideas.

I will make the middle post removable using the "Super Post" system, and attach the fence portions to the end and middle posts using the pintle hinges. This should (again, unless I'm missing something) eliminate the need to re-enforce the post closest to the house because the middle post will still be there to support the weight it would normally support. I'll probably end up having to replace the middle post, but I think this should be the easiest route.

I find the toughest thing to figure out in this project isn't parts or tools, it's confidence!