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Porch construction question

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http://boards.diynetwork.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9221916776/m/3643938967

Apr 20, 2013, 03:25 PM
Jaybee
Porch construction question
Sure, anytime. I was just starting to think that I wasn't doing you any good without knowing what you were trying to do.


Jaybee
Apr 20, 2013, 06:26 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
The framing for the gable roof is mostly independent of the ceiling joists. Since the ceiling joists are running out from the house and tied into the outside band header, all they are doing is the low-load of holding up the ceiling. The rafter system and it's collar ties are attached to the two beams that are on either end - running from the house to the porch corner posts.

It's an assumption, but if you have a poured concrete foundation for the main house then you should have the same as the foundation make-up for the porch. That's just construction that makes sense as there would be no reason to change foundation methods unless the porch was build at a different time. From your pics, the porch appears original to the structure.

You have mentioned that you are trying to figure out how the porch was constructed but you haven't mentioned why. What exactly are you trying to accomplish? Repair? Remodel?


I forgot to ask you. The band joists on each side of the porch that tie into the header. How are those 2 band joists attached to the house? Are they just attached to the house framing such as the double top wall plates?
Apr 20, 2013, 08:18 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
Sure, anytime. I was just starting to think that I wasn't doing you any good without knowing what you were trying to do.


I forgot to ask you. The band joists on each side of the porch that tie into the header. How are those 2 band joists attached to the house? Are they just attached to the house framing such as the double top wall plates?
Apr 20, 2013, 11:09 PM
Jaybee
Assuming that this is a frame house with a brick veneer then they are sitting on top of the wall plate and/or are a part of the wall. However they area actually attached, they should be supported by solid framing from underneath the beams to the top of the house framing below. Looking at the height of the top of the front window in relation to the height of those side beams, the beams should go into the house wall just under the top plate of the house wall framing. Possibly some notching involved to make them fit. But, there will be solid framing under the house side of the beams for support.


Jaybee
Apr 21, 2013, 12:03 AM
mikem201
Wouldn't they be attached to a ledger board of some type? Also, the front of the gable porch overhang that is shingled what is that called exactly? I'm a little confused on how that was framed. Its like the gable is joined with a hip?
Apr 21, 2013, 12:41 AM
Jaybee
If the two side beams terminate into a ledger, they would still need some solid support underneath to carry the load down to the foundation. Cleanest way to do this to have that solid support within the wall cavity. Since the front brick face of the house has no protrusions and there are no half-columns up against the house then the framing (called jack studs) has to be inside the wall.

It's just the gable front. Nothing special there. Just some light framing running from the beam between the two columns and the underside of the rafters to create a smooth plane for the gable front siding. In your case, the scalloped siding is used.

You will find that there are different terms used for the same thing from different parts of the country. I would recommend getting a basic framing or housebuilding book from any homestore. This will tell you more than I ever could.


Jaybee
Apr 21, 2013, 08:56 AM
mikem201
Are you familiar with lintels? They act as a header above masonry, right? If you have a window or door that has brick around it but not over the opening do you still need a lintel?
Apr 21, 2013, 09:36 AM
Jaybee
Correct. The lintel is only there to support the brick that crosses above the windows or doors. Since your house is designed with that wood band at the top instead of brick above the windows, there should not be a lintel there. There will be a header going across the window and door areas built into the framing behind the brick. These headers will be there to carry the roof framing load.


Jaybee
Apr 21, 2013, 09:55 AM
mikem201
when you have a 2 story house and obviously the joists can only span so far until you need vertical support. How is that usually constructed for a second floor? I supposed a flush beam and column on the second floor?
Apr 21, 2013, 09:57 AM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
Correct. The lintel is only there to support the brick that crosses above the windows or doors. Since your house is designed with that wood band at the top instead of brick above the windows, there should not be a lintel there. There will be a header going across the window and door areas built into the framing behind the brick. These headers will be there to carry the roof framing load.


oh ya speaking of that band covered with aluminum that goes around the house is that called a frieze board?
Apr 21, 2013, 01:44 PM
Sparky617
The vertical board, sometimes covered by gutters is called the facia board. The part that goes between the facia and the house is called the soffit and is often vented.


General Disclaimer

Any advice given here is general in nature and is not necessarily valid for your given area. If in doubt check with your local codes enforcement department for what is required when doing electrical, plumbing or structural work on your house. Permits may or may not be required in your area and home owners may not be able to DIY some tasks. I have no way of knowing if you have the skills needed to complete the tasks you are asking about, when in doubt seek professional assistance.

My advice may be worth exactly what you pay me for it. :-) For the record I did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Apr 21, 2013, 01:53 PM
mikem201
I am not referring to the soffit or fascia. I know what that is. I am referring to the long board spanning the house that is located against the brick and under the soffit.
Apr 21, 2013, 03:49 PM
redoverfarm
Ledger Board
Apr 21, 2013, 05:25 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by redoverfarm:
Ledger Board


Isn't it a frieze board?
Apr 21, 2013, 05:26 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
If the two side beams terminate into a ledger, they would still need some solid support underneath to carry the load down to the foundation. Cleanest way to do this to have that solid support within the wall cavity. Since the front brick face of the house has no protrusions and there are no half-columns up against the house then the framing (called jack studs) has to be inside the wall.

It's just the gable front. Nothing special there. Just some light framing running from the beam between the two columns and the underside of the rafters to create a smooth plane for the gable front siding. In your case, the scalloped siding is used.

You will find that there are different terms used for the same thing from different parts of the country. I would recommend getting a basic framing or housebuilding book from any homestore. This will tell you more than I ever could.


when you have a 2 story house and obviously the joists can only span so far until you need vertical support. How is that usually constructed for a second floor? I supposed a flush beam and column on the second floor?
Apr 21, 2013, 05:41 PM
Sparky617
quote:
Originally posted by mikem201:
quote:
Originally posted by redoverfarm:
Ledger Board


Isn't it a frieze board?


Google is a wonderful thing. You should try it sometime..

A frieze board is a decorative trim mounted over a house or building’s siding or soffit to enhance its appearance and make its overhang appear taller. The length of 1-by-6-inch lumber is typically installed between the brickwork and the eave to seal gaps, thereby preventing moisture and insects from coming through and finding their way into the attic. Ensure the ladder you are using is tall and sturdy, so you have easy and safe access to the parts of the house where you want to install frieze boards.

Read more: How to Install a Frieze Board | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_122024...d.html#ixzz2R8WWp3G6


General Disclaimer

Any advice given here is general in nature and is not necessarily valid for your given area. If in doubt check with your local codes enforcement department for what is required when doing electrical, plumbing or structural work on your house. Permits may or may not be required in your area and home owners may not be able to DIY some tasks. I have no way of knowing if you have the skills needed to complete the tasks you are asking about, when in doubt seek professional assistance.

My advice may be worth exactly what you pay me for it. :-) For the record I did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Apr 21, 2013, 08:04 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
Correct. The lintel is only there to support the brick that crosses above the windows or doors. Since your house is designed with that wood band at the top instead of brick above the windows, there should not be a lintel there. There will be a header going across the window and door areas built into the framing behind the brick. These headers will be there to carry the roof framing load.


Hey there,

Did you get my last couple posts?
Apr 21, 2013, 08:05 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Sparky617:
quote:
Originally posted by mikem201:
quote:
Originally posted by redoverfarm:
Ledger Board


Isn't it a frieze board?




Google is a wonderful thing. You should try it sometime..

A frieze board is a decorative trim mounted over a house or building’s siding or soffit to enhance its appearance and make its overhang appear taller. The length of 1-by-6-inch lumber is typically installed between the brickwork and the eave to seal gaps, thereby preventing moisture and insects from coming through and finding their way into the attic. Ensure the ladder you are using is tall and sturdy, so you have easy and safe access to the parts of the house where you want to install frieze boards.

Read more: How to Install a Frieze Board | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_122024...d.html#ixzz2R8WWp3G6


How do you figure its a ledger board?
Apr 21, 2013, 09:14 PM
Jaybee
Mikem -

I think I mentioned this somewhere else in this thread but you will find that there are many different and overlapping terms used in houses and construction. Some areas of the country will use one term and others another, even though they are talking about the same thing. It can make the give and take of doing things on this board "interesting' to say the least.

You've been asking a host of general questions throughout this thread. I really think that you will better find what you are looking for if get a general homebuilding book or a book basic construction techniques. You can find them in any homestore or any bookstore (if bookstores still exist these days).


Jaybee
Apr 21, 2013, 10:02 PM
mikem201
quote:
Originally posted by Jaybee:
Mikem -

I think I mentioned this somewhere else in this thread but you will find that there are many different and overlapping terms used in houses and construction. Some areas of the country will use one term and others another, even though they are talking about the same thing. It can make the give and take of doing things on this board "interesting' to say the least.

You've been asking a host of general questions throughout this thread. I really think that you will better find what you are looking for if get a general homebuilding book or a book basic construction techniques. You can find them in any homestore or any bookstore (if bookstores still exist these days).


I thought you were ok with the questions. Can you at least answer this one:

when you have a 2 story house and obviously the joists can only span so far until you need vertical support. How is that usually constructed for a second floor? I supposed a flush beam and column on the second floor?