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            DIY Message Boards  Hop To Forum Categories  Home Improvement  Hop To Forums  Windows, Walls & Doors    Is this window worth saving?
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        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted
        When we had an energy audit, we were told that our old Andersen windows didn't leak, so we decided not to replace them--there were plenty of other areas that were screaming for our money.

        The exterior of the window sills, however, do have rot. I was thinking (hoping) that I could get away with just replacing the sub-sill nose. When I started digging away at the rot, there wasn't much left of the sill (as shown in the picture).

        Are these windows worth saving?
        If so, how do I replace the sill without having the window collapse on me?

        Thanks in advance.

        Not much left of the sill
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        posted Hide Post
        you could perhaps do a little Sawzalling around the sill plate on all sides, knock it out, do a little cutting on a piece of treated lumber so the window fits, and nail in. caulk. have fun replacing the weatherstrip.

        if you find solid wood before you get inside, you could do the Bondo thing.

        this is just offhand, the pros who drop by will be more practical.


        sig: if this is a new economy, how come they still want my old-fashioned money?
         
        Posts: 5723 | Location: North Burbs, MN | Registered: Mar 14, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted Hide Post
        The board that sits on top of the sill (might be called the stool) also has rot damage. Is there a way to replace that or should I try to remove as much bad stuff as possible, treat the remains with hardener, and build back up with epoxy?

        Regarding the sill itself; it's hard to tell, since it's so rotted, but is that just 2x lumber installed on a slant?

        Rot extends above sill too
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of Jaybee
        posted Hide Post
        All windows are repairable, but it's easy to reach a point where you are spending lots of time and money to basically have a crappy window.

        The outside nosing on the bottom sill is a sacrificial piece so it's easy enough to justify replacing it. On many modern sill pieces, they are made in two pieces so the outer part can be replaced. This is also available in a vinyl no-rot form. If your basic sill is still sound, then you can get just the outer portion of the sill - attach it and fill in any voids with two-part epoxy.

        The interior stool is a separate piece and is fairly easy to replace with all new material.

        The question point is the rest of the bottom sill. It's not 2x material but a shaped sill that tapers at a 10 degree pitch. You can buy new sill material (which would have the separate part nosing piece mentioned above). The problem here is that to attach the sill properly to the rest of the window means that the entire window should be removed.

        This is usually where I make the fix or replace point - trying to remove and reinstall a damaged window can be time consuming at best and can lead to destroying the entire window at worst. But remember, I am billing out labor - something that doesn't always factor in to a DIY project.


        Jaybee
         
        Posts: 10294 | Location: Knoxville, Tennessee | Registered: Sep 27, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of joecaption
        posted Hide Post
        I just do not have the time or patients to try and patch up old rotted out wooden windows.
        By the time you go to the store and get all the needed materials and get back I could have in most cases removed and replaced that whole window with a new vinyl one that would look better, never need to be painted or patched again and would very likely save energy.


        joecaption
         
        Posts: 18025 | Location: Hartfield VA | Registered: Jan 31, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        posted Hide Post
        Given that you've removed the siding installation of a new window will be relatively easy. If you can get a stock window to fit it will be a new window install and not a replacement window. I'm with Joe, I'd replace given that the siding is out and being replaced.


        General Disclaimer

        Any advice given here is general in nature and is not necessarily valid for your given area. If in doubt check with your local codes enforcement department for what is required when doing electrical, plumbing or structural work on your house. Permits may or may not be required in your area and home owners may not be able to DIY some tasks. I have no way of knowing if you have the skills needed to complete the tasks you are asking about, when in doubt seek professional assistance.

        My advice may be worth exactly what you pay me for it. :-) For the record I did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
         
        Posts: 719 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: Aug 17, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted Hide Post
        I am fairly patient, but definitely not patient enough to take the existing window out to try to repair it.
        The other windows in the house are Andersen--they're old now, but they are Andersen and we were trying to match them. Not as expensive as, let's say, "Marvin", but not cheap either.
        Joe, take your time putting in that window. I'm having a hard time finding a lumber yard that stocks replacement sills Frown
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of joecaption
        posted Hide Post
        I've never been a fan of Anderson windows. I've been lucky enough to not have any in my own homes but I for sure have replaced hundreds that rotted out.
        Most were clad windows that were just out of warranty.
        When you contact Anderson directly they say they've never heard of a problem with there clad windows design.
        I've replaced one Anderson bay window that was so bad I took a video of me cutting open the sill and having water just run out of it and I could remove all the old rotted wood with a spoon it was so bad.
        I also showed pictures of a cross section of all the bottom sashes on all the double hungs where I made the cut in the middle of the sash and it also was full of water.
        This was 10 year old windows.
        They flat out refused to send a rep. to look them over.
        There response was they must have been installed wrong.
        Not likely since the same defect was found in over 5 different buildings in different towns.


        joecaption
         
        Posts: 18025 | Location: Hartfield VA | Registered: Jan 31, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        posted Hide Post
        I had Anderson clad windows in my first two houses. I liked them, but sold both homes when they were 4-6 years old.


        General Disclaimer

        Any advice given here is general in nature and is not necessarily valid for your given area. If in doubt check with your local codes enforcement department for what is required when doing electrical, plumbing or structural work on your house. Permits may or may not be required in your area and home owners may not be able to DIY some tasks. I have no way of knowing if you have the skills needed to complete the tasks you are asking about, when in doubt seek professional assistance.

        My advice may be worth exactly what you pay me for it. :-) For the record I did not stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
         
        Posts: 719 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: Aug 17, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted Hide Post
        Well... I spent way too much time digging out the old sill yesterday and ended up exposing lots of spongy wood on the frame. It just doesn't seem worth it. Unfortunately, I resigned myself to that decision AFTER I had gone out to buy sill replacement material (had to get to the lumber yard before they closed at noon on Saturday). I've already purchased Azek sub-sill. But, as they say, I'd just be putting "lipstick on a pig" (a driftwood pig in this case).

        I hope that Joe's experience with Andersen is not typical because it seems that the Andersen 400 casements are the best match for my house.

        Anyone else have experience with the Andersen 400 casements?
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of joecaption
        posted Hide Post
        All replacement and new construction windows can be made to size so why does it need to be Anderson?


        joecaption
         
        Posts: 18025 | Location: Hartfield VA | Registered: Jan 31, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted Hide Post
        Joe, I guess it doesn't have to be Andersen.
        It's just that the other windows are Andersen, the demo model looks solid, and, although I don't consider them cheap, they are a lot less expensive than the Jeld-Wen's or Marvins.

        Would you have another suggestion for new construction window? Have you heard of Vinyl Window Designs (out of Ontario, Canada)? One of the local wholesalers carries them.

        This message has been edited. Last edited by: SturdyNail,
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
        Picture of SturdyNail
        posted Hide Post
        I thought I'd add a little update.

        I removed one of the old Andersen wood windows today. As it turns out, only the sill was bad. The rest of the window was in surprisingly good shape. The wood was still light colored (not even stained).

        Hopefully, the vinyl windows I'll be installing will have other benefits to justify the time and expense paid to switch to vinyl.
         
        Posts: 287 | Location: Western NewYork | Registered: Jan 26, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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